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I thought about this when I read that there used to be a "10 review minimum" rule before you could get your site accepted..
One major problem here, which I know is being discussed elsewhere, is the mondo backlog you got going..
Well.. To try and do the old "two bowls with one peanut" - or something like that - memory might have failed me here.. - how about trying to combine these 2 by:
1. Bringing back the 10 review minimum..
Either exactly as it was before or maybe a different number..... like 8...... 8 is a different number.......... so's 5....
2. Introduce a rule such as: If a submitter hasn't made his 10 reviews within say.. 2/3 months.. his post will automatically be removed..
This would definitely emphasise the community aspect of hedir I think.. You could send them an email to notify them of why it hasn't been approved too which would make them think twice..
Re-submission should be allowed so that if they simply forgot or fell ill for exactly 3 months straight after submitting to hedir they wouldn't be penalised..
In my opinion, a major problem here is that a lot of submissions come from people who are out on a mission submitting to as many directories as they can, without stopping to consider what it might be about.. I know I've seen Hedir lumped in with a bunch of standard directories in these huge lists.. So this could also potentially avoid any future backlog issue created by people coming to the site [from these lists], submitting and then buggering off never to be seen again.. those sites will end up disappearing.. _________________ for a review!
Introduce a rule such as: If a submitter hasn't made his 10 reviews within say.. 2/3 months.. his post will automatically be removed..
Yeah, good point. I also think we should have a time limit. It might help if we have a list of requirements at the 'submit' page that the submitter has to agree to before the submission is allowed. One of them being; "I agree to make the required reviews within the next 90 days, otherwise my submission may be removed. After this date, I will have to re-submit my site should I request inclusion in the directory." (or whatever wording the community decide on). _________________ Please help us to improve HEDir by reviewing some sites.
The old rule was: submitted site onlys shows up in the Review Forum if submitter did 10 reviews first. That didn't work, within a couple of weeks there was no site left to be reviewed (how's that for a backlog ). I doubt if it will work when the number of mandatory reviews is 8 or 5.
I can see the advantage of mandatory 10 reviews in let's say 2 months. It kills the backlog. But I also see a problem: most submitters still won't do the 10 reviews and all reviews for submitter's site have been a waste of time because the submission thread is removed.
I know I have said this a couple of times but I still think the big issue here is that submitters simply don't know about HEDIR's concept. They don't know it's wise to do some reviews, they don't even know that they submitted to a directory which works with a community review system.
I also still think that all November 24th submissions should be removed. They're just sitting there, waiting for God knows what or who. All these submitters didn't meet HEDIR requirements of that time: the mandatory 10 reviews. That will reduce the backlog with approx. 6,000 sites.
Category forums: I was never in favor of splitting the Review Forum into way too many cat. forums. I can only see the benefit if there's a large number of active members. I don't see how this is gonna attract more of them.
HEDIR 2.0: I never commented about this because I don't want to be the "grumpy baggs, always critizing new stuff" but since you asked..
If HEDIR 2.0 means even more forums (with names like KB's, stories etc.), I don't see it happening. I'm sorry, I just don't. I just see more cluttering and more info spread out across HEDIR.
I always thought web 2.0 meant people can have influence on the sites they visit (maybe I'm wrong). Like a desktop application through AJAX and the lot. I guess the HEDIR concept, in its essence, always has been web 2.0
In short: kill the backlog by removing all November 24th sites and make it crystal clear to any visitor what HEDIR is about. No submit button on the homepage. Make it a "How to submit" button which leads to a short but to the point explanation of:
the need to do some reviewing, nothing elaborate, just something like: "your site will only be added to this directory if your site has min. 6 positive reviews. Reviews are done by members like you. You should [link to review center] review sites as well, it will increase the chance your site gets reviewed by others. It's not difficult, it's fun! Just tell us your opinion about a site.
how to submit a site (only sub-cats)
if you have any questions, please post them [link to feedback forum] here
Please allow me some more time as I am bringing a one page review system. I am still working on it and it will be very hard to explain without a sample. I will still try,
We will have four set of users
Reviewers and customers
Site Admins
Hedir moderators
Casual visitors
1) Reviewers and customers
They will not follow a submission and review process. They will follow a simpler rule. Type hedir.com/info/domain_com and review the site (or ask a question to the site admin through site forums, so one forum for each site). No need for submission or browsing. Life can't be simpler than that. We will also allow video and audio reviews. I will call it "THE TRUE VOICE OF CUSTOMER". Got cheated or not satisfied, let the world know (1+1+1+ = 111.. , discover the true community power through Hedir). Satisfied, want to say thanks to the company, recommend them to others (there can't be a better way to say thanks). I think this will bring a change, a huge change.
3) Hedir moderators
We will make sure no one is spamming or manipulating the reviews. We will go strict with them. Also we will work as (1) and (2) for few sites.
4) Casual visitor
Search Hedir and get the best resources which are recommended by the community (not by an algo alone). In Hedir we will try to integrate the community review points with Google custom search engine through a better API. I am still waiting to meet some of the Google guys for it (May be after few months I can give a visit with our requirement).
A lot to follow as HECom is at work again
Thanks,
Bret _________________ Web 2.0 bookmarking - I think you cant make it simpler.
What can be the other reasons for low participation?
People don't care about participating in forums when their goal is to submit their site.
The category-based forums are not useful. What is there to talk about? Most people already are asking questions either within the thread of their own site, or in a thread they start in the Offtopic or Feedback forums. Why would they go searching for a topic-related forum? "Feedback" makes sense and it is the first forum topic quickly visible that looks like a good place to ask questions.
I don't mean to disparage what has been done - I know a lot of thought and hard work has gone into developing Hedir. But I suggest not adding new things just for the sake of adding new things. Make sure they make sense. Evaluate to be sure each feature serves a purpose and that there is a "market" for it.
I appreciate the work being put in to Hedir to keep it fresh and relevant. I'd just suggest focussing on the main course, not the dessert.
Guest welcome to Hedir Forum, I liked your points. Why you have not registered yet? Hedir needs member like you.
Anyway,
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People don't care about participating in forums when their goal is to submit their site.
Guest, I strongly agree.
Quote:
The category-based forums are not useful.
Nope, it's the user don't want to use. Hedir tried to arrange the discussion in categorized way, so that visitors may not find any difficulties to find information. But the users still resort to the older pattern.
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But I suggest not adding new things just for the sake of adding new things. Make sure they make sense.
Adding new features is not only for the Hedir, those are all for their users. It happens that everything does not go well for everyone. But to some people it becomes useful for the time. That's why Hedir is a place where in they keep all that might be the ‘need of the hour' for you, I suppose. As you must have heard this proverb “something is better than nothing”.
Posted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:42 pm Post subject: Category-based forums
(In response to Guest's post and Jackie's post)
I too believe that few people really care about participating. Some folks find Hedir while doing a search of directories and they just (incorrectly) believe that they just need to submit their site and move to the next directory submission. Those that do have a partial understanding of the community review system, may not take the time to look through the different categories in the forums because there are many of them.
But people who are truly interested will spend a couple minutes trying to find appropriate places to post. _________________
I too believe that few people really care about participating.
Unfortunately, this seems to be true. Time and again we see people coming through HEDir who stick around for a while, make some really interesting and knowledgeable posts, only to disappear in the ether once their site has been reviewed and accepted or rejected. It's perfectly understandable that many webmasters just don't have the time or inclination to stick around and carry on helping other submitters. At the moment, we don't seem to have that 'stickiness-factor'.
I also agree with every word of the 'guest' post above.
I also agree with Jackie that you'd do us a great service by registering and offering some more of your insight to how we, as a community, can market the site to appeal to more people. And more importantly, how we can get more users to stick around, once their own site is in the directory.
I still believe in the concept of a community-based review system, and the HEDir team have given us a great platform to work from. HEDir now needs that 'something else', as well as the review system. We need to offer something that isn't being done on any other site. Don't ask me what though! Maybe it could be some sort of reward system using HEDir points? We need to find a way to attract more 'regulars', which would lead to sites getting reviewed quicker and HEDir having a more social atmosphere. There's a couple of hard-working mods here who spend a great deal of time working their way through the review queue. It would be great to see them get more help, so they would have more time to hang out in these types of discussions.
Thanks again for bringing these points up Guest.
Anyone got any ideas? _________________ Please help us to improve HEDir by reviewing some sites.
Originally posted by Cruise Cat:
I too believe that few people really care about participating. Some folks find Hedir while doing a search of directories and they just (incorrectly) believe that they just need to submit their site and move to the next directory submission.
Originally posted by Nozzmoking:
Unfortunately, this seems to be true. Time and again we see people coming through HEDir who stick around for a while, make some really interesting and knowledgeable posts, only to disappear in the ether once their site has been reviewed and accepted or rejected. It's perfectly understandable that many webmasters just don't have the time or inclination to stick around and carry on helping other submitters.
Those are all submitters’ behavior. They just visit and submit without reading guidelines. That’s all. I am with Hedir more than 8 months. Since then few queries strike in my mind, e.g. Is web directory meant for submission only? Do the actual users visit, in search of quality information?
Quote:
Originally posted by Nozzmoking:
Maybe it could be some sort of reward system using HEDir points? We need to find a way to attract more 'regulars', which would lead to sites getting reviewed quicker and HEDir having a more social atmosphere. There's a couple of hard-working mods here who spend a great deal of time working their way through the review queue. It would be great to see them get more help, so they would have more time to hang out in these types of discussions.
Nozzmoking, not a bad idea man. Expecting my share too
There used to be a plan for the points where you could use them for things like adverts etc.. I don't think it ever got fully implemented..
And yes users come and go.. I know that I do.. I like HEDir but my time is extremely limited so I only get around here every so often it seems.. When I am here, it may be a day, a week, or a month or more, I do what I can to stimulate conversation along with the review process..
But the vast majority come in, try to get listed, but get bored and move on and simply never return.. I know that a lot of work is being put in to the site, but there isn't a draw or something, other than helping review, that makes me want to come back more often.. So unless you are in to reviewing sites, you move on..
There used to be a plan for the points where you could use them for things like adverts etc. I don't think it ever got fully implemented.
Agree, I also think that should be implemented. May be that will help Hedir to grow better.
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But the vast majority come in, try to get listed, but get bored and move on and simply never return.. I know that a lot of work is being put in to the site, but there isn't a draw or something,
I guess you are right. But what can a Web Directory do to eradicate the boringness and attract their attention more.
I still believe in the concept of a community-based review system, and the HEDir team have given us a great platform to work from. HEDir now needs that 'something else', as well as the review system. We need to offer something that isn't being done on any other site. Don't ask me what though! Shocked Maybe it could be some sort of reward system using HEDir points? We need to find a way to attract more 'regulars', which would lead to sites getting reviewed quicker and HEDir having a more social atmosphere. There's a couple of hard-working mods here who spend a great deal of time working their way through the review queue. It would be great to see them get more help, so they would have more time to hang out in these types of discussions.
I agree with nozzmoking
My suggestions are: INCENTIVES for reviewers ( stupid things, like a t-shirt for the best reviewer of th moth....) and also for all MODS if hedir increases the popularity....
Posted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 8:46 am Post subject: Encourage webmaster to use his own email address
Many come back again and again, but post their new website under a new login and email. They do their fare share of reviewing and/or participating and then move on to another client under a new email and new domain.
Sometimes details of the older login gets lost, sometimes he has no more access to previous mailserver.
Encourage him to have the discipline of setting aside an email of his own separate, on his own domain (if he has one) otherwise Gmail/Yahoo/MSN will do. Force him to separate himself from any client future and present or past.
This is way he will never lose any points but instead have his websites gain more and more more prominence.
Webdesign/promoters go into auto-mode, they email many webmasters, they register a new login with a number of directories but often they can be too tired to read any fine prints.
So the main message should be hypnotizing and in big letters: "You feel like using your own domain this time .. The benefits are endless .. You know you want to ... " etc
Man, Ive been here waaaay too long. Old issues/discussions keep crawling up. I guess that's the down-side of a community driven directory. Decisions are hard to make.
IMO, category forums should all be removed. These forums will only be of any use when there's a significant number of active members, not the other way around. You divide forums in sub-forums when there's a need. You don't divide forums when there's nothing to begin with.
The incentives: that's relatively easy and I've said it before. What do all submitters have in common? They all want a (preferably) high PR link. Now let's see..... Hee, HEDIR's got some PR 4-5 pages!! Why not use the HEDIR points to "lease" a spot to members which they "pay" for with their HEDIR points? More reviews --> higher PR page. Or more reviews --> longer link placement. You could even make it a carrousel of 3-5 links.
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Maybe it could be some sort of reward system using HEDir points? We need to find a way to attract more 'regulars', which would lead to sites getting reviewed quicker and HEDir having a more social atmosphere. There's a couple of hard-working mods here who spend a great deal of time working their way through the review queue. It would be great to see them get more help, so they would have more time to hang out in these types of discussions.
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