Hedir Review : A word about The Community Review system

Yvonne · Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:06 pm Post subject:

Sorry I forgot you already give out Hedir points for writing posts. When I suggested points, or it could be stars, I meant something that was solely given/taken to members for the positive or negative review comments they give, depending on the outcome of Hedir's final review of the site.

You could just use this system of review points/stars for new members and then any members with more than, for example, 4000 Hedir Points or who have, for example, 40 Review points/stars become trusted members. Trusted members would then be allowed to submit their own site after just reviewing 10 other sites, regardless of whether their reviews agree with Hedir's reviews. I think that the rule of 40 Review points/stars would be better, since I think it would be open to less abuse than the 4000 Hedir points.

winterfrost · Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 7:25 pm Post subject:

Of course, people could also just sign up for multiple accounts to give themselves review points/stars...

Keep in mind that this is a "Human Edited DIRectory." I don't think it's realistic (nor the site's objective) to make a fully automated submission system. They are prone to abuse.

A submitter's post count or number of Hedir points will provide a baseline for whether a submission should even be considered, but in order for a free site to be approved it still has to go through a final "Human" approval.

Site approval should involve A) checking the submission thread to make sure the submitted site actually received 10 positive reviews, and B) a quick check on the submitters posting history to make sure they have made valuable reviews. Not every post needs to be checked -- a couple of random posts are sufficient. In combination with Hedir points/post count as an overall benchmark, it should take less than 2 minutes of human review to accept a reviewed site for submission.

easiserv

In the last few days I've submitted 10 website reviews and accumulated 500+ hedir points in the process. Meanwhile the site that I submitted (my own) is disappearing out the back door unreviewed for days. It's likely that reviewers tend to pick the newer sites at the top of the list so how am I ever gonna get 10 positive reviews for my site? I think that somebody already mentioned in this thread that carrying out 10 reviews and 500 points should maybe allow 1 listing to proceed forward to HEDIR.

I don't have the total answer - but I don't think that what you've got in place is ideal either. If I'd got my 10 'recommend' reviews and got accepted into Hedir would I stop actively reviewing? Maybe - but there are other ways of locking-in people, if you're so minded.

For example:-
- the hedir points 'bonus' system that you've already got could be suitably tweaked to encourage regular downstream reviewing; say increase the 'posting' tariff at certain threshhold points
- once you've been 'listed' the 'listing' should maybe expire after a year unless (say) 12 new reviews were submitted in the year.

My site used to be listed in the Hedir directory when it very first launched in 2004 and still carry my reciprocal back link to Hedir to this day (from one of my PR4 pages) so it's websites like mine that gave Hedir its start. Along the way they lost my listing and despite my writing to Hedir several times (back then) I never got it back. When I thought about submitting again just recently, I never imagined what lay in wait for me. But after some encouragement from other members (most notably Piotr) I've joined in and had a go. But there's got to be something more tangible in it for me. For every 'quid' there must be a 'pro-quo'!

winterfrost · Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:59 pm Post subject:

Absolutely...

I had mentioned previously (or in another thread?) that a "thread bumping" policy should be considered. Unfortunately a forum is a bad system for this as the OLDEST content is actually what should be receiving the most attention. I have tried to review sites starting with the oldest, but the newer sites are staying on top as they are the most active.

acorus · Posted: Sat Sep 24, 2005 3:56 am Post subject: default posts sequence

winterfrost · Posted: Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:32 pm Post subject:

The obvious problem with this is that posts which are approved or locked would have to be archived/moved/deleted as they would occupy all the top spots.

Again, I think forum participation should be key. If somone posts, then never returns to review other sites, their submissions would have to be locked/removed so they didn't occupy the top spots.

I don't think there's an easy solution using the forum format...

Yvonne · Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:46 pm Post subject:

Even if you put the oldest posts first I would think that there would still be some sites that wouldn't get reviewed and also there are still not enough people reviewing the sites.

Maybe another solution, if possible to implement, would be to only ever have 20 sites unlocked and open for people to review. Members would still be able to open new threads and post their submissions but the threads would automatically be locked.

The 20 sites chosen to be open for review would be the sites of the members who had reviewed the most number of sites (not the number of posts they have made) and where this tied, it would be determined by which member had the greater number of Hedir points.

Any of the 20 sites would need either 10 negative or 10 positive reviews to be passed onto Hedir for a final review and, regardless of the outcome, would be removed from the list. A new site from the remaining locked sites would now be chosen, by comparing the number of sites the members had reviewed and their points, and unlocked.

If one or more of the 20 sites was not getting reviews then you could change it so that all the 20 sites have to receive either 10 positive or 10 negative reviews before another 20 were chosen.

This would not only stop sites disappearing to the bottom of the stack but would also act as an incentive to people to review other sites.

When any member has 5 sites unlocked for review they would lose all their Hedir points and their counter for the number of reviews they have done would be set to 0. This would be to give other people a chance to get their sites reviewed. Even if they set up another account they would still have to build up the points and numbers of reviews.

So for example if:
Member A has reviewed 5 sites total, regardless of whether they were negative or positive, and has 300 Hedir points.
Member B has reviewed 4 sites and has 600 Hedir points.
Member C has reviewed 5 sites and has 100 Hedir points.

The order the sites would be chosen in would be as follows:
All of Member A's sites up to a maximum of 5
All of Member C's sites up to a maximum of 5
All of Member B's sites up to a maximum of 5

Also any sites that are submitted incorrectly would not be chosen, regardless of the members points or number of reviews, but the moderators would still be able to access the thread to tell the member it was incorrect.

With this system you would also need to make sure that members always clearly stated whether they recommend or do not recommend a site when reviewing it so that their reviews could be easily counted.

I hope I have explained it clearly enough.

winterfrost · Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:36 pm Post subject:

The problem with an approval system this complex is that it would require excessive coding or manpower to maintain it, but you have addressed the main concerns.

nomad111 · Posted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 9:45 pm Post subject: Hedir System

Reading the ideas above is exactly what makes Hedir different. Instead of the submission being based on guidelines and reviewed by one person, we have the perspectives of many. Its a true reflection of the relationship between the user and the intenet. Majority rules on the web, good sites survive because of the people who use them. Whether its a business owner, web developer, or seo specialist, the sites that will be recommended will be more useful compared to the narrowed and static views/guidelines of one entity. Since everyone here has differnt tastes, the directory as a whole will be more flavored and less flat than some others ha.

I will spread the word on Hedir... Very Happy

acorus · Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 10:31 am Post subject: thanks nomad111

nomad111 · Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 3:10 pm Post subject: haha

haha yes, as a side note I would like to add I was on my way out to get something to eat when i wrote that. Computers can make you hungry, so I had to go out for a byte. Embarassed

...... i just started the Bad Joke category on hedir

winterfrost · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 2:20 pm Post subject:

A few comments:

- Posts which were locked for not following submissions guidelines should be deleted. They are pushing the legitimate posts off the front pages, and they will only continue to accumulate.

- If a submitter has not returned to the forum and posted within a set time period (I would suggest 2-4 weeks) that the submission is automatically locked (and preferably deleted). Again, this will help the "legitimate" threads to stay closer to the top.

- People need to start reviewing the older sites. The last posts on page 3 have had forum participation from the submitters, yet only have a couple of comments.

- I've mentioned this a few times, but clear rules about "bumping" your own posts need to be established. Because the oldest posts are getting drowned by the junk posts sites submitted by regular contributors like acorus are getting pushed back to page 3. It's only fair that a poster should be able to occasionally move a post back up the list so it is not ignored, but rules need to be created to prevent abuse.

Just my daily ponderings... Smile

winterfrost · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 4:41 pm Post subject:

Actually, as a further refinement to my first point above, rather than deleting posts (because then people will just wonder where their posts went), a better idea may be to create two "sub-forums": Approved and Rejected.

If a site is rejected for some reason, the moderator should post why it was rejected, lock the thread and move it into the Rejected sub-forum.

Likewise, when a site receives 10 positive reviews (I have confidence that it will happen someday! Wink

) it would be approved by a moderator or administrator, locked, and the thread would be moved to the Approved sub-forum.

This would help to keep the main forum clear so the ONLY posts in the forum are valid sites still waiting for reviews.

Norah · Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 5:26 pm Post subject: This looks like a good Idea

This looks like a good Idea, having a sub forums for approved and rejected. Please share your opinion.

Norah

acorus

Approved should be main and when next proper post comes we just leave it for review, and Rejected can be deeper with clear info that this thread is for improving matters and there should be no review comments for them. And if post is rejected I would make request to site owner to make some more then 10 or 20 comments for other sites.